WD TV Live won't work with Sony Cybershot DSC HX5V Options

[peter_aus]

Hi,

I've had a WD TV Live for a while and thought it was great. However I recently bought a Sony Cybershot DSC HX5V camera and discovered serious problems.

1. The WD TV Live won't display JPG photos from the Cybershot at proper resolution. No matter what I try, they always look very pixelated or grainy.

2. When I try to play AVCHD videos from the camera on the WD TV Live, it sort of plays them, but it stutters, and it also displays a black bar on screen with the video recording date time.

I'm confident there's nothing wrong with the camera because I've tried watching the photos and video on my Bluray player (by plugging in a USB stick) and they display beautifully on the TV. The photos / video also look great on my PC.

Please help!

Thanks
Peter

[WDUser]

Check the manual for the full supported codec/container list. If the files use a proprietary Sony codec (check using MediaInfo), it won't be supported.

As for the photos, I don't know. Maybe an issue with progressive JPEGs or something. What about other similar resolution JPEGs from elsewhere? Do those show up fine? If so, compare the properties of the two to see what exactly is different.

[peter_aus]

Hi, thanks for the quick reply.

Re: Photos
I'm not sure what a Progressive JPEG is. This Cybershot camera is slightly higher resolution than my previous camera (which worked fine on the WD TV Live). I've looked at the properties of the new Cybershot photos. They are as follows:

Dimensions: 3648x2056
Horizontal Res: 76dpi
Vertical Res: 76dpi
Bit Depth: 24
Resolution Unit: 2
Color representation: sRGB
Compressed bits per pixel: 5

That's all similar to the photos from my old camera, except higher pixel dimensions. Any ideas? Even if I could run some batch converter over the photos that would help.

Re: Videos
They are AVCHD .MTS video files. I think that is a supported container?

Thanks

[WDUser]

That's all similar to the photos from my old camera, except higher pixel dimensions. Any ideas? Even if I could run some batch converter over the photos that would help.

There are many batch image resizers out there, just Google. But before running them, manually resize a few and reduce the resolution in any photo editor, then check. If it works, you can do the same for all.

They are AVCHD .MTS video files. I think that is a supported container?

Did you even check?

If the files use a proprietary Sony codec (check using MediaInfo), it won't be supported.

[peter_aus]

It's all quite odd. I've used an Image Resizer to reduce the JPGs to 1920x1080 (the TV native resolution), but they still appear pixelated on the WD TV Live. Odd.

And yes, the video format is listed in the WD TV Live user guide as being supported. But it doesn't like mine. It's jerky, and it also displays a black box on-screen with the recording date-time. The videos play fine on the PC and on my BluRay player. Have looked at MediaInfo - nothing in it suggests a Sony proprietary codec to me - but it could be I guess.

I've been doing a lot of Googling, but can't find reference to the same problem.

[WDUser]

Can you copy-paste the text format report from MediaInfo here?

As for progressive JPEGs, this is what I mean. Just a guess, but maybe you can try converting a few images to baseline with IrfanView and see if that makes any difference at all. If so, you can use IrfanView's batch converter. Also check the WD's and your TV's image/colour settings related to bit-depth (8-bit, 12-bit) etc.

[peter_aus]

Thanks, yes here is the MediaInfo for a typical JPEG from the Sony Cybershot.

CODE

General
Complete name      : G:\My Documents\My Pictures\DSC00027.JPG
Format             : JPEG
File size          : 3.37 MiB

Image
Format             : JPEG
Width              : 3 648 pixels
Height             : 2 056 pixels
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Bit depth          : 8 bits
Compression mode   : Lossy

As for progressive JPEGs, this is what I mean. Just a guess, but maybe you can try converting a few images to baseline with IrfanView and see if that makes any difference at all. If so, you can use IrfanView's batch converter. Also check the WD's and your TV's image/colour settings related to bit-depth (8-bit, 12-bit) etc.

Thank you for this good suggestion. I've given IrfanView a go, saving the JPEGs as both Progressive and Non-Progressive, and also using the software the resize down to 1920x1080. Unfortunately none of this has solved the problem. If I save as Progressive, the WD TV won't display the file at all (says the file format is not supported). Resizing the image also has no effect - it's still pixelated.

I've also tried playing with the bit-depth. I can't see a bit depth setting on my TV, but I've tried changing between the WD TV's different bit depths with no success.

I realise this is getting silly and I appreciate your help. I find it odd that there are no other postings of Cybershot owners with WD TV Live display problems!?

[WDUser]

Well I'm all out of ideas re. the photos. How about a MediaInfo report for the video?

[peter_aus]

Yes, here is the MediaInfo for a video file:

CODE

General
ID                               : 0 (0x0)
Complete name                    : G:\My Documents\My Pictures\20101230132610.m2ts
Format                           : BDAV
Format/Info                      : Advanced Video Codec
File size                        : 81.5 MiB
Duration                         : 40s 8ms
Overall bit rate                 : 17.1 Mbps
Maximum Overall bit rate         : 18.0 Mbps

Video
ID                               : 4113 (0x1011)
Menu ID                          : 1 (0x1)
Format                           : AVC
Format/Info                      : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile                   : High@L4.0
Format settings, CABAC           : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames        : 2 frames
Format settings, GOP             : M=1, N=30
Codec ID                         : 27
Duration                         : 39s 973ms
Bit rate mode                    : Variable
Bit rate                         : 16.1 Mbps
Maximum bit rate                 : 16.0 Mbps
Width                            : 1 920 pixels
Height                           : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio             : 16:9
Frame rate                       : 29.970 fps
Color space                      : YUV
Chroma subsampling               : 4:2:0
Bit depth                        : 8 bits
Scan type                        : Interlaced
Scan order                       : Top Field First
Bits/(Pixel*Frame)               : 0.260
Stream size                      : 76.9 MiB (94%)

Audio
ID                               : 4352 (0x1100)
Menu ID                          : 1 (0x1)
Format                           : AC-3
Format/Info                      : Audio Coding 3
Mode extension                   : CM (complete main)
Codec ID                         : 129
Duration                         : 40s 64ms
Bit rate mode                    : Constant
Bit rate                         : 256 Kbps
Channel(s)                       : 2 channels
Channel positions                : Front: L R
Sampling rate                    : 48.0 KHz
Bit depth                        : 16 bits
Compression mode                 : Lossy
Video delay                      : -67ms
Stream size                      : 1.22 MiB (2%)

Text
ID                               : 4608 (0x1200)
Menu ID                          : 1 (0x1)
Format                           : PGS
Codec ID                         : 144
Duration                         : 39s 474ms
Video delay                      : -67ms

[WDUser]

Ok, I'm no video expert, but I Googled a bit and here's what I found out. Apparently, the Live doesn't like B-frames all that much, so while encoding the file if the encoder is set to use a 'IBP' GOP structure, the video stutters badly on the player, but setting the GOP structure to 'IP' instead (i.e. omitting B-frames altogether) makes the file play smoothly. Now what does gobbledygook like GOP, IBP etc. mean exactly, you might ask (and rightly so, might I add! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif) ) Well, let me quote from a helpful site I managed to locate after much searching:

Understanding GOPs and Frame Types

A major feature of MPEG-2 encoding is its ability to remove redundancy, not only within a frame, but also among a group of frames. MPEG-2 uses three frame types (I, P, and B ) to represent the video. A Group Of Pictures (GOP) setting defines the pattern of the three frame types used. These three picture types are defined in the following ways.

• Intra (I): Also known as the key frame. Every GOP contains one I-frame. The I-frame is the only MPEG-2 frame type which can be fully decompressed without any reference to frames that precede or follow it. It is also the most data-heavy, requiring the most disk space. If you want to place an I-frame at a scene change or some other specific frame location, you need to set it manually. This is known as a forced I-frame.
   
• Predicted (P): Encoded from a "predicted" picture based on the closest preceding I- or P-frame. P-frames typically require much less disk space than do I-frames because they reference a preceding I- or P-frame in the GOP.
  
  Note: Both I-frames and P-frames are also known as reference frames, because a B-frame may refer to either one or both frame types.
   
• Bi-directional (B ): Encoded from an interpolation of succeeding and preceding reference frames, either I-frame or P-frame. B-frames are the most storage-efficient MPEG-2 frame type, requiring the least amount of disk space.

The use of B- and P-frames is what allows MPEG-2 to remove temporal redundancy, contributing to its ability to compress video efficiently.

A-ha, it all makes sense now! But how do we know if our files are using B-frames then? Well the MediaInfo report mentions Format settings, GOP : M=1, N=30, which, frankly, is as helpful as throwing a drowning man both ends of a rope. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/rolleyes.gif) After a lot of Googling to decipher what these meant, I came up with this gem on another rather helpful site:

M Frames: Specifies the number of B-frames (Bi-directional frames) between consecutive I-frames (Intra-frames) and P-frames (Predicted frames).

N Frames: Specifies the number of frames between I-frames (Intra-frames). This value must be a multiple of the M frames value.

Hmm, so guess since the Live seems to abhor B-frames, that must mean the M value should be 0 (zero), right? If so, then it stands to reason that N should be 0 as well. Now all this might be incidental, but it does seem mighty suspicious (plus MediaInfo reports of all my working files are conspicuously missing the GOP line), so for now I'm gonna go with this as the source of the problem, and pat myself on the back for a job well done in terms of detective work and deduction! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/tongue.gif)

P.S. Another possible problem could be with the firmware (1.04.10 has been reported by many to cause video stutter), so if you have 1.04.10 installed, you could try downgrading to 1.03.49 for instance (see the Tutorials section for tips), and see if this helps.

[peter_aus]

Thank you very much for your effort. You seem to have done a ton of research, and I've certainly learned about MPEGs as a result.

I like your firmware downgrade suggestion. I'll give that a go when I have a minute - but it probably won't be til next year.

Thank you anyhow.

Peter