Experimenting with playing ISO files Options

[JustSumGuy]

Some people on this board report that they can't play some or any ISO files with their WDTV players. I, personally, haven't yet seen any instance in which the WDTV player won't play an ISO file at all, but several of them don't seem to play correctly. Note that this means some ISO files play perfectly on my WDTV right now (I'm using the latest official firmware that came out at the end of April 2009).

As for those that don't seem to play correctly, here's an experiment I've tried...

(1): I ripped a DVD (let's call it "Movie D" to distinguish it from A, B, and C, which play fine) onto one of my computers' hard drives (most of my machines run Windows XP Pro / SP3). The output was in normal VIDEO_TS/VOB folder format on the hard disk.

(2): I created an ISO copy from that DVD folder using ISOBuster.

(3): I played both the DVD folder and the ISO file using VLC 1.0.1 on my computer. They both played perfectly there.

(4): I copied both the DVD folder and the ISO file to the external disk that I then connected to my WDTV.

(5): The DVD folder version of "Movie D" played fine on the WDTV.

(6): When I played the ISO version however, it began playing properly, but before long it seemed to choke and sputter. The symptoms were much like you'd see if you tried playing a dirty DVD disc in a standalone player or on your computer: unexpected pauses, many dropped frames in a row, audio drop-outs, and other visual and audio artifacts.

I don't know why this occurs, but I don't see how it could possibly be a codec-related issue since the DVD folder format version plays perfectly.

I'll be performing additional experiments in an effort to find out, though. For example, I'm going to try different ISO creators, specifically UltraISO, to see if that makes any difference. I'm also going to explore more deeply to see if I can find some way to distinguish ISO files that play fine and those that don't.

One hypothesis I'll be exploring is whether or not disk fragmentation plays a role. Perhaps the problem I'm experiencing playing "Movie D" in ISO format arises because the NTFS file segments are spaced too far apart on my 1.5 TB disk. I'll test that by performing a Disk Keeper defrag and trying it again (but that takes a long time for a 1.5 TB disk, so I don't know when I'll be able to try that...)

If and when I learn anything useful, I'll report back. If anyone has any ideas or other thoughts to contribute, I welcome them!

[neverlift]

Hi JustSumGuy. Welcome to the forums. Great write up, I believe it will help out a lot of people. I have only run a couple ISO files and have yet to run into any troubles myself.

Cheers!

[ToJa92]

Have you tried creating the ISO directly from the DVD? Using a program like Alcohol 120% or Ultra ISO to do a 1:1 copy of it, not just copy all the folders. I think it might help, but as I never watch any DVD content, I really don't know. Either way, good luck.

[JustSumGuy]

Hi JustSumGuy. Welcome to the forums. Great write up, I believe it will help out a lot of people. I have only run a couple ISO files and have yet to run into any troubles myself.

Cheers!

What a nice, warm welcome, neverlift! You run a great and friendly board here, so please take a virtual bow yourself. It's clear that your main purpose is to help anyone and everyone in a kind and friendly manner (which is refreshing indeed since unfortunately too many board admins and moderators seem to feel so put upon when they have to actually deal with actual [i]users[i] (IMG:style_emoticons/default/huh.gif) ...)

So cheers to you, too!

[JustSumGuy]

Have you tried creating the ISO directly from the DVD? Using a program like Alcohol 120% or Ultra ISO to do a 1:1 copy of it, not just copy all the folders. I think it might help, but as I never watch any DVD content, I really don't know. Either way, good luck.

Thanks for your reply, ToJa92. I have indeed tried creating the ISO directly from the DVD disk using ISOBuster and/or another product's "rip to image" option, and several other approaches as well. The specific list of steps I provided in my OP was just one troubleshooting attempt, chosen for its simplicity to illustrate what I was talking about. The inconsistent results remain inconsistent, but I'm still working through more experiments.

[ToJa92]

Well I myself never watch .iso's nor rip dvd's so I really don't know why it isn't working. Maybe WD works on a big FW update which fixes alot(including better DVD support, maybe not menus but better compatibility), at least I hope so.

[Choller]

I am using the latest beta (.10) and I can't get .iso's (dvd image) to work. I get the message that this format is not supported. I thought that this should be able to play iso's or do I have to do something to get this to work?

[DvDrmann]

Just chiming in. 1st post!
Firstly, let me say that WDTV is an amazing little unit that I've had the pleasure of using for a couple months now. Formats, including .iso's, haven't been a problem. Until recently.
I get the "format" error on .iso rips that are DVD9 or Dual-layer.
As far as complications...that's been the only drawback.
Any feed back, negative/positive would be appreciated.

Thanx and Greetings to all!!


DvDrmann.

[neverlift]

Hi DvDrmann, Welcome to the forums. I myself have not run into many probelms with iso files but then again I rarely use them, I do prefer the mkv container. Sorry I couldnt help you out but someone here might be able to.

Cheers!

[DvDrmann]

Thanx for your reply neverlift. I too have had no problem whatsoever with the other formats except for this most recent of issues with the larger .iso's.
The only other query i would have (which is not really on topic, thread-wise) is the aspect ratio of xvid files. They seem to be "zoomed in" just a bit.
I'll try to do a search for a solution on that...

p.s. the .mkv container is also my preferred format. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)

[JustSumGuy]

Well, I'm still having the same problems playing some ISOs as well as some traditional DVD folders (i.e, VIDEO_TS) using my WD TV. I tried defragmenting the hard drive, but it made no difference.

But DvDrmann's comments have rung a bell: The only ISOs and/or DVD folders that don't play properly have all been ripped from DVD-9 or Blu-Ray discs. In other words, they were all from dual-layer discs. Why this should cause the problems I'm seeing I don't know, even though I've very recently learned that the placement of the layer-1 to layer-2 split can be extremely important when one copies a ripped dual-layer DVD back to blank media.

The other complicating factor is that not all the ISOs and DVD folders ripped from dual-layer discs cause the playback problems I'm seeing with a subset of them. Some of them play fine, but, for example, Battlestar Galaticta's Razor has horrible playback problems (that are not related to copy protection) such as infinitely repeating one part of one scene about 10 minutes into the program. It will NOT play properly on the WD TV no matter what I try, although it plays fine on a backup DVD copy (confirming that copy protection is very probably not involved). Note that Razor will not play properly on the WD TV in either ISO or DVD Folder format.

Any suggestions?

[Choller]

I have tried numerous iso files and all failed (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

What I do now is copy the vob files to the wdtv and then I can watch them.

Sucks that it seems like I am the only one not getting it to work lol

[DvDrmann]

Just wanted to chime in and report that I experimented with one of my problematic DVD9 iso's but to no avail.
I extracted the VIDEO_TS folder from the image and re-made it with PGCEdit. Adding the proper layer breaks etc...
I thought that it might have something to do with the layer break position.
Saving the image to my HDD & trying to play the new iso with WDTV just gave me the format error again.
I decided to try another iso that was DVD9 in size and it worked great. That was of a feature film though... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
The disc that came back with an error was a television series with multiple episodes.

Speculating here...
I've come to the conclusion that, in my case, the problem iso was that of a television series with many episodes on the disc.
Other DVD5 "episode" discs played fine but size may be a factor here. Like, WDTV doesn't know "where to start"...just a guess.


DvDrmann

[turtleshead666]

Hi guys just to fill you in, i made an image of mysterious cities of gold, it worked fine then i went to show my brother and it came up with the iso is not supported error message.
cant understand why it worked one minute and now doesnt strange. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)

[JustSumGuy]

Thanks again, DvDrmann! As I indicated above, your thinking and mine seems to run along the same tracks, especially in regards to dual-layer source DVD issues and layer breaks. Like you, some ISOs made from dual-layer source DVDs will play on the WDTV, but very, very few of them in my experience. But how a layer break might cause problems on a device like the WDTV in which the very concept of a layer break is utterly meaningless would border on the mystical and hence must not be involved at all, as your own testing indicates. So the mystery of just what's causing the problems we're seeing remains unsolved.

As for dual-layer DVDs with a lot of episodes on them, I'm seeing problems with many of them -- such as with Battlestar Galactica -- that only have a few episodes on them. In fact, the worst problem I have is with BSG's Razor DVD, which has only one episode and which simply will NOT play properly on my WD TV either in ISO or in DVD folder format! The glitches are terrible and make it entirely unwatchable.

So I did another experiment: I wrote both the ISO -and- the DVD folder versions of Razor back to blank dual-layer DVD discs, and lo and behold, they both play perfectly that way! This proves beyond all doubt that the problems so many of us are encountering with our WD TV's are completely due to bugs in the WD TV player itself. I can see no other logical alternative. Can you?

[dbpca]

Hi new to the forum but wanted to add in my own observations.

I've not had a problem playing .ISOs since updating my firmware but while the video seems to play fine, there is no audio. Needless to say this is a problem. I've noticed this in DVD5 rips from DVDFab and from "shrunk" DVDs ripped using DVD Shrink. All DVDs ripped to the VIDEO_TS folders seem to work fine.

I've also noticed that I can't seem to get .MKV files to play audio. I've re-imaged the MKV with AC3 audio but still no dice. I'm playing everything through the HDMI port and the audio is set to "stereo" as I don't have a digital receiver.

Dan

[gelyon]

Dan,

MKV files with AC-3 audio should work fine. Have you tried using MakeMKV? It works great for me. The only time I have had a problem is when the audio is DTS (digital) because MakeMKV can't convert it and I don't have a digital receiver either.

[dbpca]

Thanks Gelyon, I'll try it out.

[MacCpl]

Just a short blurb to complicate the issue. I have been using my WDTV for several months now and while I did experiment for a while with WDTV modified firmware, I have returned to stock firmware due to some stability problems I was having. All of the movies on my 500GB hard drive are saved as ISOs. Even some videos that are recorded in BLR format. The only problem that I have encountered has been an audio problem with one of the ISO images. And in that case I have found that if I do a fast forward jump (start fast forward and then press the chapter button), the audio comes back. I can then back up to any part of the movie with sound.

I would have to say that there might be some issue here with the actual ISO image itself. There are certainly a lot of freeware tools out there to build an ISO image and I bet that most of us are using different ones. So I would propose that we concentrate on the actual toolset to see if there is anything there. I am using similar steps to some I have read about above. I first rip to a file set (using DVDFab ver 5) and then use ImgBurn to create an ISO.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,
JR

[jeff.petersen]

Hi gelyon,

I just registered here to say thanks! MakeMKV is awesome! I had been using HandBrake to rip to AppleTV format, then change the extension from m4v to mp4. Hours of recoding just to save a GB or so. These MKV files I made from my DVD collection look amazing on my Panasonic plasma, much better than my DVD player with component connection.

Plus, they still play great on my Macbook Pro and Vista computers with the appropriate player (Mplayer) or codec pack.

Regards